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Oakland’s budget, Tallahassee travel and funding the town’s water projects were among the issues discussed Wednesday during the virtual Oakland Seat 4 Candidates Forum, featuring Commissioner Joseph McMullen who has held the seat for 20 years, and first-time candidate Anne Fulton, running on a platform of change.
VoxPopuli hosted the forum on Zoom. It was moderated by veteran journalist Steve Mort, host of the new podcast Talking Central Florida from the News Collaborative of Central Florida, which includes VoxPopuli as a partner.
Nearly 30 people tuned in for the live discussion, including Kathy Stark, the former mayor of Oakland, and Oakland Commissioner Sal Ramos.
Grant-seeking and travel to meet and mix with legislators in the state and nation’s capitols were two issues that consistently came up — no matter the topic — with Fulton pushing for less travel and McMullen making the case for why face-to-face meetings are essential.
And in a surprise revelation toward the end of the evening, McMullen accused Fulton’s husband of threatening him during Fulton’s 2024 recall, which Shaun Fulton immediately called a lie in a message to the forum chat, and said was “categorically false” in a post on Oakland Residents. We'll come back to that further down.
Before getting into the nitty gritty on specific issues, the two candidates spoke first about their motivations for standing for election.
McMullen said it was “not the time for me to walk away” just as the town was about to level up in terms of growth, infrastructure and commercial development. “I've been involved with that for the last 12 to 13 years, and I want to continue that process.”
Fulton said McMullen’s efforts for the town for the past 20 years have been “commendable,” but said that “two years ago a lot of the residents spoke up and said, Okay, we’re ready for a change. We’re ready for something new. I’m here to be the something new. I’m here to be the voice of the new.”
Still, for her talk of bringing a different perspective to the commission, Fulton said she agreed with McMullen seven times during the 75-minute forum, indicating that on many issues, if elected, she would take similar action.
One area, though, where Fulton has differentiated herself from McMullen is travel to Tallahassee and Washington, D.C. She’s made McMullen’s travel a signature campaign issue and has argued that much of the town’s business with legislators can be conducted from Oakland.
“I don’t think that we need to be in D.C. doing things when all of our leaders, all of our state, all of our county, all of our national leaders have offices here in the Orlando and Central Florida area, and we can call and talk to them,” she said.
McMullen pushed back on that idea and explained the value of being in the capitol to meet with legislators, especially when wooing them for appropriations — something he said that prior mayors, town staff and officials did with regularity.
“There are 160 legislators. You can’t have just our two legislators telling our story,” he said. “So when we go to those different places like Tallahassee and D.C. to tell our story, those other legislators and the appropriations office wants to see the town, the staff and the elected [officials] that’s really asking for those dollars.”
He circled back to the point later in the forum, emphasizing that Florida League of Cities conferences is where elected officials learn how to be elected officials. He said Commissioner Kris Keller, new on the commission, attended a conference and “learned so much,” and that he would urge Yumeko Motley, who will assume Seat 3 in March, to go so as well.
At 6.7 mills, Oakland’s millage rate is among the highest in the Orange County area — Eatonville’s is higher at 7.2938 mills. Both candidates were asked how they would go about reducing it.
“There’s not really room to cut much,” said Fulton. She envisioned a scenario in which the elimination of property taxes necessitated cutting $2 million from the budget and excised the Oakland Nature Preserve, the Arts and Heritage Center budget, all special events, public works, human resources, the town clerk, the commission from the town. “Our finance department has been amazing at keeping a slim and trim budget while still providing nice things that bring the town together,” she said. “While it is expensive to live here in Oakland, I believe that the benefits far outweigh the cutting a few percentages off and not having those amazing things in the town.”
McMullen pointed to infrastructure and “rooftops” to lower the millage rate.
“The solution is top-line growth, having a mixed tax base,” he said, acknowledging that the town has been relying “heavily” on ad valorem taxes. But he added that a dozen years ago, commercial businesses weren’t interested in setting up shop in a town with 2,000 to 3,000 residents. But these days with a town population of 6,000 and the availability of sewer in commercial areas, “now people are knocking on our doors.”
One of the drivers of Oakland’s high millage rate is the high fees the town is obligated to pay to Orange County for fire rescue service. Mayor Shane Taylor has described the town’s partnership with Orange County Fire Rescue as “economically unviable” as a result of the county jacking up its rates by $500,000 in 2024 and 2025. The mayor has said a few times that he wants to explore “alternative sources” to replace Orange County’s fire service. But both McMullen and Fulton offered stay-the-course answers when asked for their ideas.
Fulton said that since the town can’t afford to build its own fire department, “I think we are going to have to continue with the way that we’re going now unless some magic money falls out of the sky. I think we just need to budget with what we have now versus trying to build something new.”
McMullen maintained that “we have to have that partnership with the county. We looked at that for years as what’s our possible options. … But a town our size, even when we get to our capacity, we cannot do our own fire [department.]”
Both agreed that educating residents about why eliminating property taxes would be harmful to the town was important. Fulton noted that Taylor had recently proposed holding town meetings to help explain how voting to eliminate homestead property tax would be detrimental to the town.
“He put it perfectly when he said Sitting on the commission side of the table is a lot different than sitting on the resident side of the table. As a resident, we all want lower taxes. But on the town side of it, taking out those expenses was $2,000*, and those are critical things. So like Mayor Taylor said, sitting down with residents, doing educational workshops, letting them know exactly where that money goes is going to be the key.”
[*Editor’s note: The potential loss to the town is $2 million.]
McMullen pointed out that the workshop Fulton referenced was created by the Florida League of Cities, which also organizes the trips to Tallahassee. “That’s why being a part of these organizations helps because it helps us prepare to make sure we are doing our best to save our cities and towns from unfunded mandates,” he said.
Perhaps the town’s most ambitious undertaking — besides shifting the irrigation system from drinking water to reclaimed water — is the move off of septic tanks and onto a sewer system. Only about 8 percent of the town’s 921 septic tanks have been removed. But the town is committed to the process —at a cost of about $71.7 million over 20 to 25 years. Candidates were asked where the money would come from to fund the project.
McMullen immediately said they needed to work Oakland’s network to bring in grant money.
“We’ve got to talk to our county people. We’ve got to talk to our state and our D.C. people. There are billions of dollars and grants at the federal level. Billions,” he said. “The only way we can do it is going after those appropriations.”
He noted that Republican Congressman Daniel Webster of District 11 recently sent out a request for appropriation projects. McMullen also said he’s been conversations with Democratic Congressman Maxwell Frost of District 10. Even though Oakland isn’t part of Frost’s district, McMullen said his staff has been helpful.
In addition now that Mike Parker is no longer splitting his time between working as a grant writer and public works director, but is writing grants full time, McMullen said they have the wherewithal to apply for the large-dollar grants. He added that developers also kick in money to put the sewer infrastructure in their developments. McMullen said that developers don’t bring in a lot, but it's enough that the town isn’t wholly dependent on grants.
“So that’s the solution,” he said. “Going outside this area. Grants on the state level. Corporations on the state level. Water project grants. … Going after those billions of dollars on the federal level,” he said.
Fulton agreed with McMullen that grant money was the answer, but added that the town pays two lobbyists $102,000 annually to work on behalf of the town to bring them in.
“They should be doing that without extra added expenses to go and hold their hand and say, Hey don’t forget about us,” she said. “I know that making face time is very important, but again, I stand by the fact that $102,000 is plenty enough money for them to go to D.C. and get the billions and go to Tallahassee and get the millions. Yes, going one or two times is great, but spending in excess of $5,000 a year, for a pipe dream it seems because I haven’t seen billions come back into town, is ridiculous.”
In terms of helping residents with the $6,200 fee to connect to a sewer line once it becomes available in their area, both candidates said grant money and developer money was the answer.
“I don’t think there is any other idea,” said Fulton. “Our budget is perfectly balanced, so it’s going to have to come from grant money and we’re going to have to be patient just like we have been all of these years. … Some homeowners are going to have to pay their portion to go from their house to the street.”
Candidates were asked if they were concerned that without maintenance on the canal, John’s Lake could overflow its banks and flood homes in a 500-year event. The clogged canal had been a campaign issue during the 2024 mayoral race after the commission voted 3-2 to spend $120,000 to dredge sediment from the area — twice — only to have the problem recur.
While neither candidate addressed the potential flooding risk, both agreed the canal remained a problem.
“When that issue came up, I said, I will vote for this if we have a plan,” said McMullen, reminding viewers that he and former mayor Kathy Stark were the No votes on the commission’s decision to take action in 2023. “ That was my position. We needed a plan. We still need a plan. This is not a town of Oakland issue only. This is a multi-agency issue that we all need to be a part of fixing that problem.”
“Mr. McMullen is correct. He did vote No, and he voiced his concern. Although I wish he would have been a little louder, he did vote No,” said Fulton.
“The problem that the Town of Oakland has is regardless of the two nay votes, there were three yay votes, and the town spent $250,000 and started doing things without proper planning or proper engineering. … Things went haywire. We spent more money, more money, more money. And now we are on the hook if anything happens in that area because the Town of Oakland went and started messing with stuff,” she said. “I agree with Commissioner McMullen that we need to wait and get a full plan, a fully engineered scope of how to proceed with this and not touch it anymore.”
Fulton said bringing affordable housing to Oakland was “something that is near and dear to my heart” and explained that neither her mother nor her son, on their incomes, could afford to purchase homes in Oakland.
She pointed to Habitat for Humanity, which builds lower-cost housing; and Bright Community Trust, which functions as a land bank and home builder and suggested working with people with homes in disrepair or owners of vacant lots to create affordable housing.
McMullen said that between Habitat for Humanity, Community Development Block Grants, “which we have used to bring in housing and help people with their housing, whether major rehab or total rebuild,” and the Home At Last program, which aids with transitional and permanent housing, “that’s all we can do.” He noted that most land within the town is privately owned.
The candidates were also asked about the possibility of the Bin Laden property being turned into apartments. Fulton and McMullen both said it would be premature to weigh in.
McMullen said he wouldn’t offer an opinion on any project until it had gone through the Planning and Zoning Board and the Architectural Review Board.
“We want to make sure whatever comes to that area is approved and something that they want in that area, and at the same time, it meets our overlay district outlook and meets the same small town feel that we have,” he explained. “So it has to go through the proper process. I would not give you an opinion until it goes through that process, and we have those voices being heard.”
Fulton was fully on board with that. “I agree with Commissioner McMullen. He said it exactly right,” said Fulton. “There are rules that the town has set for what can be developed in what particular area and we do not have the right to say you cannot develop XXX here.”
Both candidates responded to questions about the Seat 3 nominating process and the subsequent 2024 recall, started by Fulton.
Fulton was asked how she would work toward unity since she had attempted to recall McMullen and former Commissioner Rick Polland (who resigned in December 2024) and planned to recall Vice Mayor Satterfield and Ramos, who did not run for re-election.
While Fulton did not answer the question about unity, she acknowledged the recall was “controversial” and “ruffled a lot of feathers in the town.” But she said that she stood by what she did.
“ Everything I did, I did with facts. Any accusations that I made, I had facts to back it up. I know that speaking up, even when there's someone in your face pushing back, speaking up when it's not the popular opinion is hard to do, and it makes people uncomfortable.
"But I wholeheartedly believe that when there's an injustice, as the majority of the town felt after Commissioner Ramos was re-seated, that someone needed to stand up and say something. Someone needed to stand up and do something because apathy and complacency get us nowhere. So whether you supported my decision to do that or not, I hope that that shows the community that anytime something comes up, anytime someone feels unheard, I will be the one to stand up and say, This is not right.”
McMullen answered questions about the nominating process and whether there had been a coordinated effort to put Ramos back in the seat he’d vacated to run unsuccessfully for mayor. McMullen said there was no coordinated effort.
“I chose Mr. Ramos because of experience,” he said. “I am not going to get myself in trouble for a $599 [a year] job and come together and do some kind of plan. It was all about experience.”
McMullen also explained the rationale for his applicant scoring sheets. Applicants were scored 1 to 5 on professional experience, community involvement, volunteer engagement, public speaking and educational background. All are subjective categories, with the exception of educational background.
Attorney Yumeko Motley was Mayor Taylor’s choice for the commission. With her law degree, McMullen gave her a 5 for educational background. McMullen also gave Ramos a 5 for his high-school diploma. How the two equate has long been a question.
“This guy has a business for over 30+ years. That’s experience. That’s experience. … Just because somebody’s a lawyer, being a lawyer doesn’t make you the best elected official. It was experience,” McMullen said, sidestepping the question about education.
Between the questions about the recall and the nominating process, McMullen asked if he could say something about the recall experience. He said that Fulton's husband Shaun posted a photo of his home on social media with the address blurred, that he’d taken a picture of him leaving a polling place during the 2024 mayoral election and that he'd been "threatened" with "In box stuff." He said it was "scary" and that at the time, his daughter was "concerned."
"That's when it got personal to me," McMullen said.
Shaun Fulton immediately sent an all caps message to the forum chat, visible only to moderators, that said, “HE’S LYING!”
Later in the evening, Shaun Fulton posted a public response in the Oakland Residents Facebook group where he said, “At no time did I threaten Mr. McMullen, for any reason, at any time. That allegation is categorically false.”
Shaun Fulton acknowledged posting the photo of McMullen's home, which he said was six doors down from his. But he said it was a yard sign issue and that McMullen had too many "Sal Ramos for Mayor" signs in his yard “in violation of the town’s sign regulations.”
“The photograph was shared solely to highlight what many residents perceived at the time as an ‘old boys’ culture within the Commission (sic), a culture where rules did not appear to apply evenly. Once the sign issue was corrected, the photograph was promptly removed,” Shaun Fulton said in his post.
As they closed, Fulton again commended McMullen on his "dedicated service" and "great love for this town," but insisted that the lobbyists could manage on their own, and that one could stay plugged to legislative matters in Tallahassee and Washington, D.C. via MyFloridaHouse.gov, FlSenate.gov and govtrack.us. " You can stay in the loop without spending extra money going out of town without spending thousands of dollars to go on trips," she said.
McMullen pointed out that they were quibbling over $7,000 — the cost of his last three years of travel — on a $10 million budget.
" Every mayor I've served with has gone to Tallahassee. You can't have someone else that's telling our story," he said. "This is not a Zoom/Teams process. We have to be there. So when I talk about experience, experience matters during these times. Stability matters when decisions have lasting impact because the decisions we make today are going to make a big difference. ... Oakland success is not by luck; it's by leadership."
Early voting for the Seat 4 election takes place March 2 through March 8 from 7 a.m. to 7 p.m. See our guide for locations. Election Day is March 10.
